How do people seriously use Java?!?

Francesco Pretto: comment 1

Mon, 01 Mar 2010 02:54:45 -0800

I don't understand your irritation: you are an experienced developer, why taking conclusions (Java is a toy) at the first trouble? Java succeeded in being a small and clean statically typed and type safe language: I think it was actually one of the first languages that forced people to think in patterns, rather than discover them late (for example, a directory hierarchy reflecting the "package" hierarchy will be honored while compiling sources: this is a perfect example of respecting "Convention over Configuration" paradigm). java is not perfect: it seems you discovered "package" visibility; it's not the solution to all evils but it works if you follow Java compatible patterns, and it's much simpler and maintainable than c++ friendship. Java doesn't force you you to use an IDE or have a build framework: I always succeeded in manually compiling java sources after correctly setting the classpath variable and the files in a correct directory hiearchy (reflecting "package" one, as said). Sure, any java developer recommends you to use an IDE and a build framework: in C development using an IDE is up your choice but a build framework is a must for any serious project; using an IDE will give the bonus of online error checking (this the good of being statically typed and type safe), refactoring operations and other useful functions that may be not quickly obtainable using a generic editor. java is limited regarding advanced programming techniques: no things like multiple inheritance, no latent typing (=no c++ like templates). java is an old language and before or late it will be replaced (c# would be a good candidate, but try to look at it if you want an example of how to bloat a programming language with a plethora of reserved keywords for every single problem). Java java is all this and other things, but it's definitely not a toy and is definitely not used only for web applets (I think this affirmation is so wrong that actually web applets is the field where java performs worse, IMO. In fact the web now is Flash and Silverlight, maybe HTML5 in the future).

IanRomanick: RE: comment 1

Mon, 01 Mar 2010 13:35:07 -0800

This isn't my first trouble with Java. It was the trouble that finally irritated me enough to openly whine about it.

I guess the problem that I have with both Java and C++ is that both languages try way, way too hard to keep you from hurting yourself. In the process, they make some really straightforward things just excruciating. I know what I'm doing. I know how to do it safely. Either help or get the hell out of my way. I know I'm not the only developer who feels this way. I keep thinking that one of these days I'll try to write a frontend to LLVM that implements just enough of the useful bits (implemented in non-broken ways) of C++ to be compelling. I'll try to avoid a C++ rant for now.

Also keep in mind that I was frustrated and venting.

Anonymous: comment 3

Thu, 08 Jul 2010 03:05:08 -0700

That's so stupid to cry over a language you just started xD Maybe you should wait a bit! If you don't like C++ and Java, maybe you should also tell you don't like object oriented programming ? Things like Eiffel would kill a dirty guy like you

IanRomanick: RE: comment 3

Thu, 08 Jul 2010 10:15:34 -0700

That's the thing. I do like (most of) C++, and I like Python. As far as OOP goes, it's a tool that has a lot of uses, but it's not the solution for every problem. In Java, it's the only solution you're allowed to use. This old post from Stevey's Blog Rants sums it up nicely. Not only is Java excessively nerfed, it artificially ties one hand behind your back. Fail.